England getting destroyed

[hanuma]

lampard and gerrard are better than gattuso and seedorf and beckham can easily be better than pirlo in the holding role.

imo england would win something if they played these players in that formation......obviously carrick would be better than becks at that position, but we all know svenn isnt going to drop becks.

[Spursmeister]

The reason we bought the Swede in was to rejuvenate the side, because every England manager before him wouldn't dare to not play with the old well-known faces... Remember the side with the likes of old boys such as Ince, Wise, Batty etc...

Well the Swede did good, he got shot of the old has-beens and bought in lots of exciting young players to join the experienced boys such as Becks and Neville etc. The team looked much better and we seemed to instantly compete at a higher level.....

Now it seems that Sven too has sadly fallen into the 'Must player the big name players' trap and history looks to be repeating itself again as todays older players will be flogged until they drop...

Let's look back at the Brazil 98 squad, how many of those players were still in the Brazil side come the world cup of 2002? A few yes, namely Ronaldo, Rivaldo, Cafu, Ze Roberto, Dida, R-Carlos, and Junior, but that's it for the whole squad 7 players! there was not one midfielder from the 98 squad in the 2002 squad (ok execpt Rivaldo, but he's more a striker really...) so in 4 years they had dropped 15 players to gain 15 new, now that's change, that's progress, and that's what wins world cups!

OK, Brazil is a country that seems to churn out masses of football talent to a level which most other countries can only dream about. Still they could have easily stuck with some of those players from the 98 squad, some of whom still play at a high level today, but they don't, they move on using new, exciting IN-FORM players instead of relying on the usual suspects...

Sven will never drop the likes of Becks and Owen even if they are in terrible form. Sven insisted on playing a half-fit Beckham at the last world cup when several better equiped, fitter players could have taken his place and had more of an impact. The Brazilians are not affraid of change, the England managers are, the media is most of the problem, dictating how a manager should be running the team, I fear that the first team and even the squad will need another good shake up some time soon and this won't be done until Sven goes...

[hanuma]

my only problem with svenn is that i hoped he would take us to a more cultured place than 442.

i was reading 'all played out'....a great book about italia 90.....and players like waddle and barnes said how playing on the sides of a 442 totally inhibits the creative ability of a team and stops them from being able to fill gaps in defence.

the only teams that i have seen do 442 brilliantly are man u when they had the perfect 4 man midfield (beckham, keane, scholes, giggs) and wenger's arsenal because they dont just stick to a rigid flat four midfield.

in "all played out" it chronicled the great success bobby robson had when he played a sweeper against holland and later in the tourny.

i think england can play 442 if they play

swp carrick/parker gerrard/lampard downing as the midfield 4.

but if he insists on beckham being in the side he has to play 433 or a diamond.

[Spursmeister]

We're certainly on the same wave-length. "Sven' can you hear us!!!".... probably got his head up some tarts skirt... ah, good luck to him...

[russe||]

Originally Posted by hanuma

of course he should play right when asked to...thats not what im saying.

this is what im saying.

.........................beckham
..............gerrard..............lampard
......rooney.................................cole
..........................owen

the front three given a completely free reign.

just imagine how good that could be....for a start everyone but becks would be given the role they have at club level and none of them would have the current ludicrous straight jackets imposed on them by 442.

We we don't quite have to imagine anymore as Sven is going with something like that.

As Owen is suspended it will be:

.........................beckham
..............gerrard..............lampard
........swp..................................cole
.........................rooney

Although I like the fact h is prepared to try new things why the fcuk didn't he try this in a friendly? Why did he wait till we play a competitive game to try it?

[mr.watford]

Because Wales wont be a competitive game

[hanuma]

agreed....wales are **** and will only have davies, hartson and gabbidon to do anything for them.....without savage they have no real pulse and certainly wont be as good as denmark.

its not really an experiment as such as only ashley cole and david beckham WONT have played much in a similar system.

i expect this to be the turning point in the world cup campaign....the day a good system was settled on.

[Spursmeister]

Funny how we all spoke about this and now it is Sven's chosen tactic... Clever bunch ain't we... LOL!

Other than his passing Beckham's greatest asset is his tireless work-rate. He is usually the player that will have run the most in any given game and so it is fitting that he's playing a more central defensive possition so to break down attacks...

I'm excited to see how this is going to pan out tomorrow, I just hope we don't reach half time at 0-0 for Sven to bottle it and revert back to his usual 4-4-2...

Still hope Defoe gets a good run out though, he deserves it...

[Roo]

Tsk tsk ... comparing England to AC Milan. I reckon AC will beat England; They got a better defense and strikeforce not to mention Kaka.

This is an amusing thread started by hatred for Sven and then moving on to tactics. I'm sorry but before Sven you guys had a whole host of useless coaches; El Til, Kevin Keegan( ), Hoddle; Ok so Sir Bobby was good.

Heres my formation for England; (Cos i'm an armchair critic like you

------------------------------------Robinson-------------------------------------
Carragher(gaz injured)-------Terry--------------Ferdinand----------------Cole---------
-------------------------------------------Parker-----------------------------------------------
----Beckham(stay right ----------------Gerrard----------------Lampard--
-------------------------------------------------------------Rooney--------
----------------------------------------Defoe-------------------------------------------

[mr.watford]

Originally Posted by Roo

you guys had a whole host of useless coaches; El Til, Hoddle;

Come back when you get a clue about football

[Spursmeister]

My thoughts exactly

[Roo]

Originally Posted by mr.watford

Come back when you get a clue about football

He he , guess I should keep my mouth shut, this is a touchy subject huh? :mute:

[mr.watford]

Nope, it's just that anyone who thinks Venables did a bad job for England must be either mentally retarded, Scottish, or an idiot

[hanuma]

plus your team is pretty poorly thought out....i.e. if you have a diamond you need attacking fullbacks to give width.

carra is a centreback that can play right.

most top club sides would beat all top international sides;

1. they have better players
2. they have a better team spirit and understanding
3. they have better managers in general.