Judge: "Accounting fraud is not illegal as it does not alter the course of a season"

[Jager]

No, private companies are not obligated to do so.

Public companies must make their balance sheets public.

[azzurri]

Juve have it on their official website, so do many other serie a clubs. I havent gone on Inter's site, but if its not there, I can imagine y.

[Jager]

Originally Posted by azzurri

Juve have it on their official website, so do many other serie a clubs. I havent gone on Inter's site, but if its not there, I can imagine y.

Juve is not a private company, they are a public company if I'm not mistaken.

No I can't imagine why, since other than yourself, I have heard differently.

So as a fan, I'm trying to find a reputable, reliable source of this.

Inter FC is a private entity. They don't have to divulge their personal finances to no one, other than the league.

Has the league publicly stated each clubs financial state? I want an official release.

[azzurri]

Milan, September 24 - Italian champions Inter Milan and European champs AC Milan stand accused of swapping second-rate players for rigged fees to make sure their balance sheets made them eligible for Serie A.

On Monday a Milan prosecutor filed a request to indict Inter Chairman Milan Massimo Moratti, Milan CEO Adriano Galliani for allegedly conspiring to cut debts between 2003 and 2005 to get their accounts in shape for pre-season audits.

Only clubs with the right financial requisites are allowed to enter Serie A each season.

There have been suggestions that, if convicted, Inter may have to hand back the title it was awarded by default because of the later and much larger Calciopoli scandal.

As well as Moratti and Galliani, Milan prosecutors also asked for indictments against Inter Deputy Chairman Rinaldo Ghelfi and a former Inter executive, Mauro Gambaro. Despite the fact that it predated Calciopoli and apparently did not involve similarly dirty tricks, the probe has posed image problems for Inter, the one big club not involved in Calciopoli.

Ever since news emerged of the probe earlier this year, Moratti has denied wrongdoing, saying "I have nothing to fear".

The billionaire oilman called the allegations "absurd".

Implying that he would never need to stoop to such methods, he said: "I spend millions of euros a day".

Milan issued a statement after the indictment calls saying it was confident the "full accuracy" of all the club's balance sheets would be "certified as promptly as possible". Galliani told reporters that Milan had "never committed any crimes".

Legal experts said that, if the case comes to court, club owners would fight the charges by claiming it was not possible to place an exact value on a player.

The cases also looked set to run up against a newly shortened statute of limitations on balance-sheet fraud, the experts added.

Galliani has already contended that prosecutors would find it hard to prove that the clubs deliberately over-valued players because "clubs are free to put the price-tag they see fit on a player".

Earlier this year, prosecutors singled out the case of one player, goalkeeper Simone Brunelli, who was allegedly swapped several times by Inter and Milan between 2002 and 2003 - with only the beneficiary's revenue boost and not the other club's outlay being recorded. Brunelli, 23, reportedly admitted his involvement in the affair.

Several other unidentified players were traded by Inter and Milan ahead of the three incriminated seasons.

None of the players reportedly played for either club, instead being farmed out to minor outfits.

Judicial sources said this appeared to have been a widespread practice at a time when many clubs were having trouble making the money to stay afloat.

Lazio's former owner, disgraced ex-Cirio boss Sergio Cragnotti, is also implicated in a probe into the same alleged practice by the Italian Soccer Federation - along with Rosella Sensi, current boss of the other big Roman club, Roma.

The Milan criminal investigation was launched on the basis of allegations by the chairman of another Serie A club, Giuseppe Gazzoni Frascara of Bologna.

Juventus, which was stripped of the 2006 title because of Calciopoli and relegated to Serie B, is also involved in the FIGC probe along with a string of other clubs including Sampdoria and Genoa.

Galliani served out a ban from the Calciopoli affair last season because it was reduced on appeal to a few months.

Only the sports disciplinary side of Calciopoli has been settled, however.

Criminal investigations are still underway in several Italian cities in connection with the match-fixing and other allegations.

ANSA.it - News in English - Soccer: Milanese bosses accused

[azzurri]

To be expected, u can now take Moratti's name off that list.

[azzurri]

Calciomercato.com | Primopiano

Judge Paola Di Lorenzo:
"Accounting fraud is not a punishable offence"

=

Inter and Milan have been cleared of all charges.

a) They werent found innocent. Merely the law was changed to accomodate what they did (how convenient)

b) Some1 tell that to all the clubs (Torino, Salernitana, etc) who over the last 5 years, have been relegated on something that up until now, was illegal.

c) It does alter the course of a season since your finances have to be in a certain state in order to be eligible to play in serie a. Therefore Milan and Inter shouldn't have been able to play in serie a.


Only in Italy. After reading through this thread, I cant help but smile. I guess its one of the perk's u get when your parent company is the leagues main sponsor (Inter/TIM), or your owner is the majority shareholder of a company who has massive TV contracts with the league (Berlusconi/Milan).

Just like Moggi said a few month's ago, the power of the FIGC is centered in Milan. Moggi is right once again.

[Jager]

Milan and Inter are in no danger of going bankrupt, while the teams you mentioned did go bankrupt.

So moving Milan and Inter down a accounting indifferences would make little or no sense..and could possibly destroy the league entirely.

I'm not sure about all the rules, and what you say might be correct. However I think Milan and Inter could possibly put a better case forward than the teams you mentioned.

The league is looking at Fiorentina and Napoli, and they don't want that to happen again. That is why the rules were put into place, for the protection of smaller teams that don't have deep pockets backing them.

Bann them now, or they fold so to speak.

[azzurri]

Firstly, "accounting differences" in this case constitutes fraud. Anywhere but Italy and u go to prison. I cant say I didn't see this coming, since forging passports and health insurance only lands u fines.

It's interesting to note that the judge didn't clear either club's name from charges of fudging player values and transfer's, he said what they did isn't a punishable offence since it doesn't effect the standings (wrong, since the whole reason both clubs took those measures was so they could register their team's for the season, something they couldn't have done otherwise with their balance sheet). Furthermore, prior to this development such offences got u relegated, but now the law has been changed to accomodate for these types of actions, which is extremely unfair to the club's who got punished.

This ruling is bullshit anyway u look at it. TIM and Mediaset saves both club's asses, again.

[Jager]

The clubs that got punished were not punished for what these clubs were accused of.

Completely different.

And the clubs that got "punished", were punished for their own good, as the rules were established so teams didn't over spend or didn't spend above their means.

Milan and Inter, regardless of their current finances, have very deep pockets backing them.

Does that make it right or wrong, that is not for me to say. All I'm saying is that the law is not black or white. And you are wrong. The law can be interpreted in many ways, there is a grey area. I'm not going to bring up examples in Canada...but look at drinking drivers in certain parts of the world.

Sentences get reduced or dropped or things get thrown out of court for the smallest things.

What I think happened here is that there was no way to prove what a player is worth or not, as you could argue until your blue in the face, and how does a court prove that against a professional football team whose job is to that?

Court is not cut and dry, and proving somebody is guilty is much harder than proving that you are inocent.

[azzurri]

It's not different.

There are certain criteria your balance sheet must meet in order to register for the serie a season. The circumstances for each case are different, but in the end they were all relegated because there balance sheet's didn't pass the league's test.

Milan and Inter had to resort to creative accounting so there balance sheets passed these tests, otherwise they wouldn't have been able to register for the season. The fact both have a wealthy owner and more annual revenue just means they can stomach the debt. Juve were able to pass these tests even in serie b, so for Milan and Inter to have to fudge their accounts is strange.


The judge didn't prove either clubs innocence, he just "de-criminalized" the actions of both clubs, which is extremely unjust and unfair to all the club's who have got relegated because their accounts were poor.

As for the difficulty in assessing a player's value, when a no name injured reserve player who makes under $1000 a week unknowingly get's transfered without ever signing anything, for million's of dollar's, its obviously bullshit. Furthermore, for this player to be transfered between the same 2 clubs 3 times in 2 years at the same inflated price is equally bullshit.

[Jager]

How do you know Juve didn't fudge their books? Did you audit them? I'm not really sure why you bring them up?

Both clubs have maintained their inocense, and what I read doesn't corelate what you just said or what you read on anti-inter or anti-milan sites.

I read that there wasn't enough evidence to proceed. You can't convict on hear say, or what Juventino think happened.

But the fact remains, this should never gotten to this point, they just should of fined them and left it at that.